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EricGreenwood
7 November 2012 9:51PM
Response to AylesburyOx, 7 November 2012 9:41PM
So the fact that some a4e staff On this very site and others hide under anonymity, because they feel threatened. thats a lie is it.. It happens People being sanctioned for being 5 minutes late for a meeting after they had a job interview.. truth.. search for it.. You will never see anything wrong with a4e because you work for them.. thats the only reason..

we disagree because you profit off the work programme, you get paid by them. i suffer at the coal face.. So come on who do you work for.. i asked several times. My bad experiences has been over 4 YEARS in 3 different a4e schemes. Other groups have the same experiences as me so i guess you will call them liars as well.

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7 November 2012 9:46PM
Response to AylesburyOx, 7 November 2012 9:33PM
But a4e doesnt train people. They dont run courses, I wanted to do a PTTLS course no money. other people wanted to other courses No money..oh yes give people a peice of paper produced by a4e about internally run a4e courses that mean absolutely Nothing. thats not training, thats not real training. You go into an a4e or other work programme and ask them about training.. most will say no money..

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7 November 2012 9:41PM
Response to EricGreenwood, 7 November 2012 9:25PM
Actually it means that 4% found employment through A4e and 96% while working with A4e found employment. It doesn't necessarily mean their A4e experience was a waste of time; some of that 96% probably used the experience as a catalyst to find employment and took on board their Advisors support.

Now you are just fabricating information - staff being bullied, being sanctioned for anything. Simply not true.

You and I are destined to disagree on this, and not because I'm right and you're wrong, although I am and you are. But because your bad experience will always influence your judgement on the matter.

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7 November 2012 9:41PM
Response to AylesburyOx, 7 November 2012 9:33PM
first the £46 million could be used to reduce rents in local businesses, the rents on the outdoor market run by the council is very high, but that £46 million is just for a4e. the projection cost of the work programme is in the BILLIONS.

So reduce the local business rates. that would get more people working in them. Lets see, why not get some land, hire some of the unemployed builders electricians to make a house sell for a profit, use that to buy more land.. and so on.. wouldnt that create sustainable jobs.. Why not stop the outsourcing of jobs? Wouldnt that be better. How about setting up retraining courses made up of the unemployed those with life skills. to teach others. and thats just off the top of my head.

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7 November 2012 9:37PM
Complained yes i have but u have to complain to your provider then u dont get a reply the dwp say its out off there hands and u can not see a adviser from the dwp while your on the work programme which is just mad if u ask me,yes it is poor treatment very poor and im sure there is alot more out there maybe someone other than these providers should ask whats its like and how much help u get from them.And yes there are lots of people who dont want to work and need a push a kick up the back side and when u use a private company for this its all about making money not help,how about taking the first 400 pound they get for not doing any thing away from them and then watch them drop out.

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7 November 2012 9:33PM
Response to EricGreenwood, 7 November 2012 9:21PM
What jobs would you create for £46m across the country? Seriously, come up with a way of spending that money to create enough sustainable employment across the entire UK and I'll agree with all of your comments.

£46m spread out would barely scratch the surface the unemployment in the UK. It is a better use of money to train people in jobs that do exist and to provide support services to get people into these roles.

I'd suggest looking at your local government website for Labour Market Information and see just how many opportunities there are available. You will be amazed.

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7 November 2012 9:25PM
Response to AylesburyOx, 7 November 2012 9:20PM
RUbbish again.. less than 4% of people got a job via a4e. that means 96% didnt. in 18 months. No fraud will be sneakier and it will take time for whistle blowers to say because people who work are scared because they are being bullied. They did the same scheme last time.. and the time before and they failed as well. The do not work. the facts that channel 4 got and looked at show that.

What me complain, when you can be sanctioned for anything or threatened with sanctions.. You definitely work for a4e, or the PR firm she hired.

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7 November 2012 9:21PM
Response to AylesburyOx, 7 November 2012 9:14PM
The solution is use the money given to these useless providers use it to Create jobs. not force people into applying for any job going. That is the solution. Only those who profit from these schemes want these schemes. If you are on them you are not unemployed, if you are sanctioned you are not unemployed. Hiw come a4e put forward 10,000 plus people for sanctions, and the dwp has only agreed to 3000. They have sanctioned more people that they got jobs for. use the £46 Million give to a4e to CREATE jobs.

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7 November 2012 9:20PM
Response to EricGreenwood, 7 November 2012 9:09PM
Again, you are using your frankly poor treatment as a way to tarnish a while company. I can't comment on your situation as I wasn't there but it sounds awful and I hope you complained.

If there is fraud it will be found as Emma Harrison has made too many enemies - see my previous comment.

These places do work for the majority of people who come through the door, like any client centred service they don't work for everyone but I see no reason to throw up our hands and declare failure 18 months into a 5 year programme, where the ultimate aim is to support people into work and training.

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7 November 2012 9:18PM
It would be nice if my adviser did some work atleast did what he is paid to do.

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Share AylesburyOx
7 November 2012 9:14PM
Response to mkmky1, 7 November 2012 9:02PM
Darn you caught me...

Yes of course I'm deluded because I want people to work together to make things right. Clearly you would rather complain about there being problem than try to find a solution. Shame.

As for hidden fraud - Emma Harrison has far too many enemies in government for any fraud not to be found. Trust me they will search high and low for it and if it's there, they will find it.

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7 November 2012 9:09PM
Response to AylesburyOx, 7 November 2012 8:44PM
I have been bullied, one adviser said I know where you live and you are wrong about the buses. He got the wrong place.. I had an adviser laugh at me because i said some places are hard for me to get too as i rely on public transport and have osteoarthritis, so i cant walk far. She LAUGHED. Payment by results is open to fraud. Look at the fraud case still being investigated In surrey NOW. 6 a4e staff members arrested and bailed. The recent investigation was done by a company that a4e paid of course they wouldnt find anything wrong.

So you ar saying if there was fraud we wouldnt know about it.. and since we dont know about it that means theres no fraud. The public accounts committee said the Department for Work and Pensions (DWP) had missed "vital evidence" of possible fraud, particularly at the firm A4e.

Committee chair Margaret Hodge said the DWP had "not been proactive in setting in place systems which root out fraud". Perhaps if you look at watching a4e, johnnyvoid's site. Boycott workfare, and many many other sites. I guess you work for a4e, or one of the others. Perhaps you dont want to see the fact these place DO NOT WORK. and they do more harm than good.

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7 November 2012 9:03PM
They r bullies they lie and cheat make up reasons to try and sanction u because most off time they dont no what there doing,Im with working links there staff are really bad ive been 6 times so far and i asked for help and asked them to job match me with the kind off jobs i can do and get told we dont do that, i am a disabled person can not walk far or use my right hand very well but ive still been able to work for most of the last 30 years and what kind off job do u think they have asked me to do well its ride a bike around town dropping off food.ive not had one good thing from it like most would say they seem to take the first 400 pound then dump u,im all for getting help to find a job but thats not what there doing even when i was told i had to do the mandatory work activity and they could not find me any where they tryed to sanction me,It needs to stop.

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7 November 2012 9:02PM
Response to AylesburyOx, 7 November 2012 8:44PM
"If the system were open to fraud then you and I wouldn't know about it"

I agree they have hidden the fraud,to many Politicians have hitched their wagon to the WP


Are you sure you are not Jonty? If not you are just as Deluded as he is!

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7 November 2012 8:57PM
What makes little sense is the fact I attend a sub-contractor (The Council) who ran the FND,but now lose 12.5% of the attachment fee to the Prime,granted the Prime set up a portal where jobs were sent to your account,click of a button and off goes your CV to an employer..sounded great,sent off daily CV's......The system never went live...The Prime never informed the Sub,who in turn never informed the Client,who wasted 3 months,as this was the only method they would accept to prove you had applied for positions..Was anybody held accountable?...The programme manager has informed me via E-mail "There is no money for training,you need to get a job" I asked him what his purpose was?....Blank stare....YOU NEED TO GET A JOB! I now attend 2 sessions weekly,where they will only accept 14 unskilled positions(I have to apply for) as proof of seeking work.

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7 November 2012 8:44PM
Response to EricGreenwood, 7 November 2012 8:27PM
You and I must mix in very different circles then as for every negative comment I've heard about Work Programme staff I'd say I've heard at least 3 positive ones.

Work Programme staff, JCP staff and anyone in a client facing role for that matter will only be able to give what they get - they are open to abuse, they hear endless excuses and they are under constant scrutiny by the government and by those who they are there to support. These people are not bullies, they are not the enemy and they are not Camerons evil henchmen they are people trying to do an extremely tough job under increasing difficult circumstances. Working together is the only possibly solution.

The payment system isn't open to fraud as the recent investigation has testified. If the system were open to fraud then you and I wouldn't know about it.

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7 November 2012 8:27PM
Response to AylesburyOx, 7 November 2012 8:10PM
I know and have seen the same people as clients and they ALL say the same thing. All three of my adviser did nothing but bully me, demean me, insult me. I felt threatened by sanctioning by them. I know people country wide each with the same experiences of the work programme, some at ingeus, a4e, serco, g4s. Every single one of them has teh Same stories. The same experience. The same incompetent advisers.

The payment by results system is open to fraud. The pressures the management put upon the advisers make short cuts desirable and that way leads to fraud. All the "clients" are is £400.

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7 November 2012 8:10PM
Response to EricGreenwood, 7 November 2012 7:57PM
You seem to be making the mistake of using your experience as an excuse to judge the service as a whole. I'm sure the 3 Advisors you dealt with were in turn dealt with by their Team Leader, the same way a person struggling in any company would be dealt with by theirs.
Yes you are 'dumped' into A4e, but by the DWP. Yes you are also correct that you are a tick box but remember that Advisor who's box you are ticking needs to support you into work as much as possible otherwise you won't help them meet their extremely high target.

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Share Naggedbycats
7 November 2012 7:57PM
Response to AylesburyOx, 7 November 2012 7:48PM
I'm sure it's spelt substance misuse. Perhaps you should proofread those CV's after you've "updated" them, no?